Old Fart History Lesson (from an Old Fart Teacher):

Back in the times of the ancients, those who had a horse or horses needed them for more than just brute force.   They didn't "work" like they did in the 1600's and beyond.....most of them were war horses, and those who rode them wanted to stay alive.....and wanted their partners to stay alive.  Xenophon already covered everything a soldier needed to partner with his horse so that they worked as one (hence the Centaur myth), keeping both alive so they could do it again.  As any Veteran can tell you, you don't go into battle under intimidation and come out alive....usually the intimidator was nowhere to be found, or was hit by "friendly fire".

Then horses became more commonplace.   They were there for plowing and going to town and bringing home stuff,  or they were used as draught horses and pulled delivery wagons.  These horses belonged to people who did not have the time/patience/knowledge to train a horse, they just went to the nearest livery/auction to get a horse to do whatever they wanted it to do.  As more people wanted them, trainers had to "train" them quicker.  And many of the methods were, at best, rather ugly.  Tying to a post and waving sacks at it, causing it to panic until it finally just gave up, and quit fighting.  Pulling its feet from under it proving it couldn't run away.  None of these meant that they horse was "used" to anything.....it had simply broken its spirit and became a slave.  Well, there were always those who panicked and ran later on, with those who weren't quite so.....ummmm.....sadistic.

Now, horses are more of a luxury.....or a hobby.....a hobby not everyone can have.   So we have become a kinder, gentler horseowner.  We do all sorts of things with our new friends....note they are friends now, not just something to be used up and thrown away for another.  These kinder, gentler horseowners want to spend "quality time" with their friends, and so the trainers came up with a new name to go along with it....Natural Horsemanship.  These trainers KNOW that most people only have one or two horses,  and so they have come up with considerable games to interest the human during these "quality times".  That, and considerable admonition to stay away from those nasty ways of yesteryear, suddenly constitutes NH.

However, what it does do, is create a trust bond between two completely different species.  And that's a good thing.

So, basically, Natural Horsemanship is going back to the way Xenophon described it.....and yes, it uses the natural instincts of the horse to gently "push" it in the direction you want....it uses unnatural things like saddles, bridles, spurs, bits to help you and your partner to communicate to each other....in the least traumatic/stressful way possible.

So that's my take.

My blog:  www.horselistening.blogspot.com

It didn't take 1 day to create.....it won't take 1 day to fix.

I was composing while you were posting.   I agree with you about the "robot horses"....most of the show ring horses look like that, too.

But I have to disagree on "it's confusing and difficult for a horse to learn the human's emotions, etc."   Actually, it's a lot easier for THEM to understand US than the other way around.  They "read" our body language (Equus, their language, primarily uses body language as their speech), recognize pitches in our voice, and thus know exactly how we're feeling long before they get touched by us. 

Ever notice when you are in a hurry, you can't catch a horse?  Well, "hurry" = scary/danger/something's trying to kill me!  You don't think they can sense your hurry...hear your high-pitch tones....see you walking like a super-predator (directly to the gate, directly to the horse, walking hard on the ground).....Oh, yeah, I'd want to be caught by someone moving like that!!!!

Yep, they are SOOOOOO much better at reading us!

My blog:  www.horselistening.blogspot.com

It didn't take 1 day to create.....it won't take 1 day to fix.

I myself, don't see much of a difference either.

A few things I do notice more so in NH, is most NH trainers pay more attention to the horses body language and they seem to do more ground work. They seem to go off more what a horse does naturally and kind of has the horse come to them, instead of teaching a horse how to understand you (in a way.. if that makes sence at all, no, yes?)

Example. My friend is all "traditional".. I am more "NH"

My friend longes her horses, does ground work and gets on. She does not pay much attention to the body language. She tells them what to do and when, during the longing sessions. She can be rather hard on her horses, where I like to be softer.

I longe my horse, but when my horses show sighs of submission, I let them slow down (although, they only slow down when I let them). Whenwe round pen, after I round pen them, they come to me and they follow me around the pen.

So, really its not so much differences between Traditional and natural.. but more the difference in our pereferences.

I'm no expert but just look at how happy most of the NH trainers horses are...

-Savvy4Horses

(Hope I didn't offend anyone, I was just trying to define this!!!)

"People may tell me that they are great riders, fantastic horsemen, or knowledgeable horsepeople. I never believe them until I speak to their horses."

Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born. ~Garrett Hardin

It didn't take 1 day to create.....it won't take 1 day to fix.

But again, just look at how happy Pat Parelli, John and Josh Lyons, Monty Roberts (and you can't say they aren't until you've heard the Shy Boy story, plus Joe Camp- author of The Soul Of A Horse and the guy Monty got to do a demo- said that the whole Horse Whisperers And Lies website thing is a lie put out by Monty Roberts father's sister to protect their family's name!)... Just watch this youtube video- I'm not saying you do this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_VQ2W1bKfw

and then watch this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DcjL4c8NHtQ

Also, the Parelli's horses aren't dead at all! When they are working at liberty they buck for fun and run and do free rollbacks.

"People may tell me that they are great riders, fantastic horsemen, or knowledgeable horsepeople. I never believe them until I speak to their horses."