| Pat Parelli |
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| Clinton Anderson |
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| Linda Tellington-Jones |
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| Stacy Westfall |
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| John/Josh Lyons |
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| Chris Irwin |
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| Alexandra Kurkland |
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| Other |
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| Please do not include your personal instructor as 'other.' I don't mean this as an insult (I have a great personal instructor too!!!) but I just want to know who you think- whether you approve of their program or not- is most in it for the horse? I personally hate most of them but if one of their methods didn't work then I'd simply buy a DVD from another. Sorry to say this to all you Parellites (I was one of them) but PP didn't even start out as an NH trainer- he says it on his bio on his website- so technically he didn't really have a talent with horses, he just found out about pressure and release (pr) and the flight animal instinct, made a whole bunch of games, and priced everything to where he could afford five hundred dollar chaps for his in it for the money wife...
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Personally, John Lyons is my favorite. All his training is for the rider and horse's safety and enjoyment. However, his methods don't work on all horses.
But to answer your question specifically, I do think John Lyons is in it for the horse- but I think he's just as in it for the rider, and creating harmony between them.
 
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I don't think it's really a fair question to ask. I mean, they're all in it for the horse to some degree. If they weren't they wouldn't be IN horses. I honestly don't understand why people need to follow a specific trainer.
I've never followed any of the BNTs to the same extent people follow the NH trainers.
Sure, I"ll read their book but I'm not going to 'follow their methods' to a T.
Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born. ~Garrett Hardin
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You must've read my description wrong Misfit! I said that if one DVD didn't work for my horse then I would just go to someone/where else to get help. Besides you're being a hippocrit, you said just the other day that PP was only in it for the money!? Could you please read a whole post before posting? I don't mean this ignorantly- just as a tip. Please do not reply nastily.
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Monty Roberts and Stacey Westfall focus on the bond with their horse! I mean, look at Stacey and her horse Roxy! Stacey ride freestyle reining competitions! Roxy can bow, smile, etc. Monty Roberts found the way to connect with horses by using their language. I joined-up with my mare, and she will follow without a lead rope everywhere! She does anything I ask of her too! All the other trainers are good too, but this two really stand out I think!
Canny11
There is no secret so close as that between a rider and his horse
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To be loved by a horse, or by any animal, should fill us with awe-
for we have not deserved it.
Marion GarrettyMy heart galloped through the skies that night. Spirit:Stallion of the Cimarron Stop Horse Abuse+Slaughter!
 
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I fail to see in what manner I've been nasty. Believe me, nasty I can be and that definitely wasn't it.
Yes, Parelli is in TRAINING for the money, but I wouldn't say he's in HORSES for the money.
A better question is "Who actually is in it for the training of the horse/rider".
Your inference that I didn't read the whole post before replying was a bit ignorant. I assure you, I did.
What I meant by following the specific trainer is that I still feel you are focusing too much on the 'what' as opposed to the 'why'.
I honestly don't pay much attention to the newer NH people. Old-school people are fine, but I really hate 'in a box' training programs.
I think the biggest thing that bugs me about this thread is one sentence in your OP: "PP didn't even start out as an NH trainer- he says it on his bio on his website- so technically he didn't really have a talent with horses"
So unless you start as an NH trainer (on your own, without being taught by others) you don't have talent with horses?
Society does not need more children; but it does need more loved children. Quite literally, we cannot afford unloved children - but we pay heavily for them every day. There should not be the slightest communal concern when a woman elects to destroy the life of her thousandth-of-an-ounce embryo. But all society should rise up in alarm when it hears that a baby that is not wanted is about to be born. ~Garrett Hardin
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| First of all, I think ALL of the Big Name Trainers were originally "in it" for the horses. The reactions of their fans, and the economics of it all simply got the best of them. They simply got too big for their britches and forgot that they are NOT the be-all-and-end-all of horsedom. In fact, they don't REALLY have an original idea.....just a lot of frosting on the cake. I was lucky enough to be in on the "ground floor" with most of these trainers. I knew Linda Tellington-Jones before she became a horse-hold name. I remember John Lyons before he became a "trainer" (he always trained horses, but this was before it became his main role)....as well as George Morris (I remember when he was in Medal-Maclay classes!)....when Monty Robert first came on the scene (before he went to England)....when Clinton Anderson first came to the States.....so I saw the original intent....the original focus and the original thinking. It simply got twisted from the "here's some things to do/watch for/think about and adjust accordingly for your animal" to the "Just use my program, exclusively, and there will be no problems". I "chose" Linda Tellington-Jones because she continues on doing her thing, has a low-key approach and admits to coming up against horses that don't play the game and having to sit back and figure out how to work with them so they WILL play. I've been using TTouch since she came back from Israel with it and both animals and humans. It's the next best thing to a message. Savvy, you turned on the Parelli's with the same venom you showed to people here who warned you about them. When you find a new tool for your toolbox, it's GREAT to be excited and eager...but if/when it doesn't work, don't throw out the baby with the bathwater. There are good things in the Parelli box, as well as the tremendous amount of crap. They DID start with the same premise of trying to "find a better way to unite horse and rider".....they just got overwhelmed with their own success and got cocky (and in my opinion, stupid). You'll find there are things Linda Tellington-Jones does that are VERY similar to the Parelli games.....however, her FOCUS is not on "playing games" but using that time to bond, and see HOW your horse responds certain cues. Her whole idea of the "wrap" seemed absurd to me, until I really understood what she was doing Physically/psychologically with the horse (plus reading about an autistic child who used the same approach on herself to help her cope was very helpful, tooA)....and when I tried it on a horse with "space" problems (she would step ON you rather than walk beside you....she just HAD to be touching her handler/other horse) it worked just like she said it would. However, it did not work on a horse with just the "pushy" attitude.....nor was it supposed to. So my take on many of these things is a bit different....cuz I was there when it got started, and not after things got a bit out of control.
My blog: www.horselistening.blogspot.com It didn't take 1 day to create.....it won't take 1 day to fix.
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Right, Odanata (did I spell it right?) that was what I was trying to portray! You really have a way with words to express what we're feeling. I know I've been kind of hard on PNH but I'm so p'od that I gave up my dog's training lessons, my riding lessons, the horse I borrowed and loved (Loverboy) and all my savings for the cr-p! Then I watch the On Line DVD and it is just one big ad for the next DVD!? But to be fair, when I first came here you all jumped on me for liking PNH- horseless told me I was an idiot who couldn't get on my horse, Misfit was all against the method, and several others got mad at me- including Sunny56. So now that I hate it you all hate me again? I understand now that not one method works for every single horse. For my horse I use TTouch, some PNH, clicker training, and traditional wisdom but all for different things- like TTouch before a big race, clicker training to pick up her legs, PNH to work on her ground skills, etc, etc... I'm not 'dedicated' to one trainer, that was not the purpose of this post. My idea was who do you think RIGHT NOW is in it for the horse, not when they started, RIGHT NOW. And I understood they were all in it for the horse to some extent but I should've added that I meant more in it for the horse than for the money.
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| If any of them were actually in it for the horse instead of the money, right now, they would have affordable prices, rigth now. They do not. At least none of them I have checked into. I like some of Chris Cox's ideas. But his prices are rediculous. So it is easy for them to say they want to help all horses and all riders... But if they really did they would make themselves more affordable IMO.
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canny11 (10/28/2009)
Monty Roberts and Stacey Westfall focus on the bond with their horse! I mean, look at Stacey and her horse Roxy! Stacey ride freestyle reining competitions! Roxy can bow, smile, etc. Monty Roberts found the way to connect with horses by using their language. I joined-up with my mare, and she will follow without a lead rope everywhere! She does anything I ask of her too! All the other trainers are good too, but this two really stand out I think! Might want to educate yourself a little more on Monty Roberts. He most certainly did NOT create Join-Up. All he has managed to do is alienate himself from most horse people and have a few lawsuits brought up against him. He's horrible.
Mommy to a Sweet Little Girl! Jordan Renèe- Jan. 13, 2009
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